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  1. David
  2. MOXF Series Music Production Synthesizers
  3. Friday, 19 October 2018
I sometimes use my MOXF standalone, and then I need to have Utility -> Midi -> Other -> MIDI IN/OUT set to "MIDI" to receive data from a secondary controller (over 5-pin DIN) and use the MOXF's sound engine for that.

I also want to use my MOXF together with a DAW and then I need to have Utility -> Midi -> Other -> MIDI IN/OUT set to "USB" to talk to the computer.

So I would have expected the "Quick setup" button to be able to set this up so when I select "Quick Setup" -> "DAW rec" then MIDI IN/OUT is set to "USB" and when I select "Quick Setup" -> "Standalone", then MIDI IN/OUT is set to "MIDI". But it looks like this parameter is not included in what "Quick setup" sets up.

I guess this is a minor annoyance only, but is there a quicker way that I can set the "MIDI IN/OUT" parameter, than going into that the three level deep menu (that I apparently tend to forget, in worst case leading to a troubleshooting session instead of a creative one)?
Responses (9)
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
If this seriously is hindering your creativity, we recommend you include both keyboards and the computer in all your configurations. The MOXF has a built-in MIDI and audio interface that allows you to connect to the computer via USB, yet be able to play either keybed to trigger either tone engine, as you may require/desire. The external keyboard stays connected via standard 5-pin cables throughout.

With the computer doing the Routing and the MOXF acting as MIDI interface, you’ll be able to work with Local Control Off on the keyboards, the computer will see the MOXF as Port 1, the external device as Port 3

With this configuration (MIDI I/O = USB) you can use either keybed to play the MOXF Tone Generator, you can use both simultaneously, playing separate Parts. You can have both keybeds play the external synth. You could setup so that each set of keys plays the other Tone Generator... it is that flexible. Any possible configuration.

Depending on your DAW software, you may be able to recall specific templates with a click or two, recalling the exact configuration you need rapidly. If you have all the tools ... why not use them?

At this price point (MOXF) while you can configure your own MIDI setups (Quick Setups) they are not as in-depth as they would be on the the top of the line models... where this kind of thing can be stored on board (MONTAGE, for example, can...I’ll need to verify but MODX may do so as well ... that is memorize the MIDI I/O setting as a part of the Quick Setup settings.

But you can certainly use what you have to do what you request, but you’ll need to use the computer along with the two keyboards. Gear is supposed to help with creativity not get in the way.
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Hi and thanks for the answer - it's probably not going to harm my creativity long term as I'll probably learn to check this switch first if things are not working...
What does harm creativity however, is all the ways a computer can fail (crashes, clicks, pervasive updates, you name it), which is one of the main reasons I bought a MOXF and not just a master MIDI controller to use with a computer.

There seem to be lots of ways you can make smart shortcuts with the MOXF, and I feel I don't know all of them yet, so I was just wondering if there was a way to create some shortcut for this setting as well, but apparently not so.
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Not sure if you are a fan of the television series “The Twilight Zone”, there was an episode where the protagonist felt that all his machines were out to get him. They wouldn’t work for him because he didn’t believe in them, they were in a conspiracy against him... don’t be that guy. Computers don’t really crash that often. Updates, well we at Yamaha are guilty there too. We are actually proud of the fact that we update our hardware... we can add new features and functions to improve the workflow. It’s a part of landscape now.

Once you spend some time *whipping* the computer into shape, it will behave and work for you, not against you. Knowing that a computer was built for civilian use, not musician use is the first step. The civilian (average user) is a casual user... so automatic power saving, automatic updating, and other settings are the default.

As a musician, when you are doing music, you want 100% of your computer’s attention. You don’t want it doing housekeeping inbetween the bridge and the chorus, you don’t want it searching the internet for updates at the same time you are overdubbing the lead part. As a musician user, if you don’t customize your computer to be On at all times, no power saving routines... you want your computer’s complete attention when you are doing music. And that is your responsibility. Don’t blame the computer - it wasn’t designed to do what you are doing. (There are some great articles on preparing your computer for making music).

What you are attempting to do is just one of the things the computer can do. The clever software programmers create the driver and the other items you need to make the computer a musical entity. But you have to make sure you have your computer setup to serve your needs.

And as I mentioned, the farther up the price point ladder, the more elegant the features. But even on the second tier there is much you can do yourself to gain control over your gear.

Hope that encourages. Yes, there are many shortcuts, features and functions... once you adopt them you can lock them in - these will GREATLY improve your experience. Take your time... know that somewhere out there folks are having a great experience with the same exact gear you own!

One tip: I’ve dealt with this subject for more years than I want to count... and it has been my finding that there is an unrealistic target that frustrates many musicians... it starts when they say: “I just want to have one setup that works for everything.”

Well that sounds great, but it ain’t gonna happen! Realistically, you should aim for a minimum of three. These are the three main functions of any recording studio setup:
One to Record (all input)
One to Overdub (one input, all others playback)
One to Mixdown (all output, playback)

Those are the three major functions in the studio.
Learn these three and all the others are easy as pie!

But expect to have (as we say in NYC) a coupla two tree options... you can learn to configure these and store them as your Preferences, and suddenly things are smooth.
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
So, Bad Mister, actually I've written sound card drivers for a living, for some part of my life...

And so I have first hand experience of how notoriously difficult it is, to get a system without clicks or other hiccups in an operating system which was not designed with pro audio being one of the primary use cases.

How hard it is to make sure your update does not crash or break someone's workflow, given a strange combination of other hardware or system configuration you didn't consider when writing that code.

Computers will inevitably end up running non perfect code, because they were written by non perfect people.

Even the MOXF runs non perfect software, probably not including MIDI IN/OUT in the quick setup was an oversight of not considering my specific workflow, and if that is working better in newer hardware, then fair enough, I suppose. For the MOXF, I've seen the USB connection breaking down on non frequent occasions, but whether that is a problem of the MOXF or the host computer I don't know, and I don't feel like investigate that, when I want to spend my spare time writing music instead.

To sum up, I have good reasons for not trusting computers...because they might run code written by me! :D (And other non perfect human beings.)

All the best!
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
So you are a Twilight Zone fan?
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Nope, just hopelessly realistic :-)
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
May or may not be related to this thread, but I'm using the moXF as my central controller, particularly for exporting the sequencer & Arp clock to a Moog Grandmother. I was successful in using the MIDI OUT to the Moog, but not using the USB this way (just began trying so..). I need the USB for PC/Cubase & running my PC audio. I go through a usb-hub to also connect to the Moog.
Ref Manual page 149, UTILITY/SF4: "MIDI IN/OUT: Determines which physical output/input terminal(s) will be used for transmitting/receiving MIDI data. Settings: MIDI, USB. NOTE The two types of terminals above cannot be used at the same time. Only one of them can be used to transmit/receive MIDI data."
But when I change the Utility Setting to MIDI, it will change back to "USB" after the moXF has been turned off. I can't get it to stay on "MIDI".
The "two types of terminals" statement is throwing me a bit. Can I have both types "plugged in", even if I'm using them for different purposes?
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
The MOXF has a built-in MIDI and audio interface. This means via a USB connection the MOXF can act as a MIDI interface for itself and one extra device connected to its 5-pin MIDI jacks. And it can act as an audio interface for itself and one extra device connected to its A/D Input.

Here’s how this works: the MOXF should be set to MIDI I/O = USB.
This allows the MOXF to communicate with the computer on five MIDI Ports.
A MIDI Port is defined as a MIDI IN and a MIDI Out, each moving 16 MIDI channels.
Port 1 is the synth engine of the MOXF
Port 2 is for DAW Remote Control. This lets the front panel of the MOXF become a Control surface for Cubase.
Port 3 is the 5-pin MIDI IN/OUT on the back panel
Port 4 is reserved for the MOXF Editor VST
Port 5 is for building Remote Templates for your VSTi plugins

Set LOCAL CONTROL = OFF on both keyboards.
So when you have a MIDI Track in Cubase where MIDI In = MOXF-1 (Port 1) and MIDI Out = MOXF-1 (Port 1) you will be playing the MOXF
If MIDI In = MOXF-1 (Port 1) and MIDI Out = MOXF-3 (Port 3) you will be triggering the Moog when you play the MOXF keys

If MIDI In = MOXF-3 (Port 3) and MIDI Out = MOXF-3 (Port 3) you will be triggering the Moog when you play the Moog
If MIDI In = MOXF-3 (Port 3) and MIDI Out = MOXF-1 (Port 1) you will be triggering the MOXF when you play the Moog

See how that works?
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
I think I see that now for when I'm utilizing Cubase. But when I'm not using Cubase, I like to run the Moog & MOXF sequencers together without the need of a PC. This only seems to work when I have MIDI IN/OUT set to MIDI instead of USB, and using the midi cable.
I found out that the usb hub must have the upstream (common) port connected to a computer. This doesn't allow the MOXF & Moog to talk by USB on the hub as they both have to be downstream ports.
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