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  1. Rainer
  2. MODX Series Synthesizers
  3. Monday, 01 October 2018
Did I really understand that correctly: if I want to load both the voices and the performances into MODX from a MOXF All File .x6a, that contains user voices as well as user performances and user samples, then I have to load the x6a file twice as a library. Once for the voices (plus arps and samples) and once for the performances (plus used voices plus arps plus samples). Do I then really have e.g. the samples twice in memory, or does MODX recognize which samples it has already loaded and which are still needed?

Thank you in advance
Responses (7)
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Performances on previous generation synths were built up from voices. Some players use a voice alone as the "thing" they play for a tune. Some will only assemble together one or more voice(s) into a Performance on the older generation synths and only use those. Some have will use a mix.

Ignoring presets and only focusing on your USER content - if you only use Performances, then you only need load up the Performances from your MOXF. This alone will load in all voices and waveforms and arps in order to assemble the the Performance to play it as it sounds on your MOXF. You need not load voices AND performances from MOXF in order to create a MODX converted-from-MOXF Performance. The conversion process will automatically "pull in" all that is needed for the Performance.

Now, if you happen to have Voices you created that you do not use within a Performance -- OR you just have some Voices you like to play alone without the context of other "stuff" in a Performance that uses that Voice -- then you CAN import the voice if you want.

When you load Performances - all your Performances from the X6A will be pulled in. If you load Voices - all your Voices from the X6A will be pulled in. In the case of voices, you will likely have a bunch you do not use alone and will want to trim out (delete) those converted voices that are only there to assemble Performances.

As far as sample duplication - I do not have a handle on the gory details of the conversion process in order to tell you.

After loading - it is possible to take a look at your Performance to determine.

Your answer is going to depend on your usage particulars - but, for me, my previous MO I only ever used my own user Performances or, sometimes, I would use a preset voice for tunes I would play guitar leads on (and nothing else). Since the guitar leads (voices) are built in - I wouldn't convert those. I would just convert Performances only and not convert voices from previously saved content.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MODX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 1
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Hi Jason,

Thank you very much for the detailed answer. Unfortunately, the question I had is not answered: does this procedure occupy the sample memory twice with the same samples?
I have third party software for the MOXF that contains both voices and performances that I would like to use in MODX.

Greetings
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MODX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 2
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
The smart use of the Flash Memory would be to only install the data once and to only install the data that you will use. As is typical there is no one-way to proceed... it will depend on your preferences and the data you are working with...

What you do will very much depend on the specific data you are working with; the better you know the data the better you will be able to assemble what you need and avoid unnecessary duplicating of your data.

Every program in the MODX is a Performance. When “importing” MOXF Voices they are loaded as Single Part MODX Performances. The significance of this is that they become “searchable” as Single programs. (This is your preference).

If the question is, “Can you inadvertently duplicate data?” The answer is probably, yes, but only if you don’t know how your data is used and proceed without seeking to find out the most efficient way to load your data.

Example Workflow:
In other words, setting the Load “Import Option” = “Voice” or “Perf” will depend on how you intend to use the data in your new keyboard.

If a MOXF Voice is only used in a Performance there may be no need to import it as a Single Part
If, however, you want to catalog the MOXF sounds as individually searchable programs, then you definitely want to set the Load “Import Option” = Voice.


This means you will have to determine how you plan on using the data. Here’s what you can conclude from what you already know...
Initially, to load MOXF VOICES you must set the LOAD “Import Option” to “Voice” this will load 384+32 or 416 Single Part Performances. It is highly doubtful that your MOXF .X6A File includes 416 new/unique Voices that need to be installed. Most commercially available MOXF Libraries provided (maybe) 128 Voices and a few example Performances. Therefore you will be *selecting* which data is the “keeper” data.

Before proceeding figure out exactly how many (new/unique) Voices you are dealing with... because you expressly do not want to include any data that is not unique. The MOXF always had “placeholder” data... in other words, all 384 Normal User Voices and 32 User Drum Kit Voices were always included in a file that you saved... you are really only interested in moving the new data in that .X6A File... not the placeholders. The MODX only needs the unique/new data.. So you will be discarding the “placeholders”. That is why the initial load is a *temporary* thing, it’s so you can sort through the data, weed out the stuff you don’t want and then assemble the stuff you want to keep into the MODX User Bank. (It is from the MODX User Bank that you will create your “keeper” MODX Library File... .X8L

MOXF Performances were always made from Voices in the current MOXF... determine if you ever use these Performances - usually created to show the Voices in some kind of context... and these show off any custom Arpeggio data. If you never use them - don’t bother with them. If you do use them - bother with them. That’s an important choice.

MODX Rules you must understand:
_ Load as “User File” overwrites the current MODX User Bank (similar to how your .X6A File overwrote all internal MOXF User Bank)
_ Load as “Library File” bypass the current MODX User Bank.
_ Data can be moved, using “Library Import”, from a MODX Library to the MODX User Bank *without* overwriting the target location.

Suggestion:
I would load with the MOXF data with the “Import Option” = Performance to the USER Bank. (And this is what Jason was trying to tell you)... because it contains, in all likelihood, all or most of the new Voice data, and it will include all the Waveforms, and all the Arpeggios made for the unique data.

Then I would ‘install’ the “Voices” to a temporary MODX Library... where I could now review the data, make sure I have everything I need from it, in terms of the unique (new) data. If not, then use the “Library Import” feature to move any ‘unattached programs’ to the MODX User Bank. (Unattached programs would be those not used in a Performance from the new/unique data.

Goal 1: Assemble new/unique data in the User Bank
1) Load the MOXF Performances to USER,
2) then load the MOXF Voices to LIBRARY,
3) then using “Library Import” to grab any MOXF Voices data not used in any Performances... to join the others in the User Bank.

Goal 2: Create your permanent Library
1) Once all new/Unique data from your MOXF .X6A File is properly imported to the User Bank, Save as... “Library File”
2) “Delete” the temporary Library, and install your newly created .X8L file. Keep the file in a safe place.

This would avoid you installing any data that is unnecessary.

Final word: each situation will be different. So no one write up will apply to all possible contingencies. It will depend on the data you are converting, how the data was arranged and presented. If the MOXF Performances are an important part of the Library spend the extra effort to get them, if not don’t bother, create your own Performances... there are so many more functions and features now...

Hope that helps. If you get stuck (because each situation can present its own challenges) post back here.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MODX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 3
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Rainer, here's a shorter response that may address what you're asking - using the same assumptions I had with the last response and rationale for the guidance given.

1) When loading content into a keyboard from USB - each time you load anything - it's difficult for the loading operation to "figure out" what you've loaded before. So if you twice load anything that uses the same user samples -- chances are very likely you will end up with duplicates.

2) One example of loading waveforms twice is loading BOTH a user voice and user performance from the same X?A file. Meaning you load the content into Library(ies) and then assemble the Performance + Voice backups from a previous keyboard back together again in the user section.

3) Chances are that you do not need Voice + Performance - you may only need Performance data. This would minimize your chance of having duplicate samples.

You'd have to map out every Performance and every Voice and every reference to a user sample (Waveform) on your old board in order for anyone to tell you what's going to happen. If I was concerned about duplication - I would only load Performances. The only caveat is if you have voices which are not "inside" Performances - then those you can either manually reconstruct or load. Depending on how many, as in count of voices not used in any Performance -- that you actually use and want to keep, may inform you what to do. For example, if you only have one MOXF voice you want to keep and there are 64 MOXF voices that will be converted - then you may be spending more time deleting unwanted voices than just recreating the one voice from scratch (MODXifying a MOXF voice). It may ultimately serve you more to regenerate the voice from scratch. This assumes you have the MOXF so you can look at the settings/parameters of the original voice.

A single load/convert operation should generate no duplicates assuming the original content had no duplicates.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MODX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 4
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Many thanks to Jason and Bad Mister for your detailed answers.
I understand now and know how my workflow has to be.
In this context I noticed a small problem, which makes the procedure a bit more difficult (maybe an idea for a firmware update). As Bad Mister correctly writes, many MOXF third party software contain only one bank of new voices, the other banks contain the old placeholders. After importing it into MODX as a library, you can only sort it alphabetically or by date. This makes it very tedious to find the actual new voices in order to import them into the user memory. If you could sort them by their original bank number, that would be very helpful.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MODX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 5
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Although technically possible, MODX Performance names are 20 characters maximum in length and MOXF Performance names are 20 characters maximum in length. If adding bank name - the Performance name would have to have extra characters to fit this information. There's no other real place to "stick" this kind of information. It's not part of the system as-is.

If you list in original order (guessing by date) - the order I am assuming is 1-128 is USR1, 129-256 = USR2, 257-384 = USR3, 385-512 = USR4 followed by the drum voices.

Each screen should have 16 voices per screen page - 8 pages per bank.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MODX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 6
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
That’s a pity. Ordering by date unfortunately has no effect at all, even if you sort it up or down.
I assume all MOXF voices have the same date.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MODX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 7
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