YamahaSynth.com Forums

This is the place to talk about all things related to Yamaha Synthesizers!
  1. Ben
  2. Sherlock Holmes The Voice
  3. MX Series Synthesizers
  4. Tuesday, 09 February 2016
Hi,

I'm going to be using my MX49 to control sounds on my MOX61 (In Master mode controlling either Song/Pattern mode) and also will be playing its own sounds as well. Right now I will be using Performances 1-16, with Performance 16 only sending midi data. When I select a certain Master on the MOX it will send a Program Change to the MX for Performance 16 so I'll be able to press just one button get ready for the next song in a setlist. (I'd like to be able to use insert effects on all my other voices so using just one Performance with my Voices on each part probably won't work for me.) I'll be using the Melas tools for editing.

The problem I'm running into is that the MX's Midi channels are fixed for each Part in a Performance and it doesn't seem like it's possible to turn off the Midi transmit for Part 1 or 2 in a Performance. It also seems like when you recall a Performance it defaults to Part 1.

So just wondering how I would accomplish the following:

1. I need to be able to change from Performance 16 to say Performance 1 and then play only the MX Voice at that point without changing the MOX's Master slot. So Performances 1-15 need to be set so they do not send Midi to the MOX or at least not on the same channel as Performance 16.

2. Ideally, I would set the MOX to receive on channel 2 and have Performance 16 transmit on Ch. 2 while Performances 1-15 either don't transmit Midi at all or only transmit on Ch. 1. Can I set Performance 16 so it transmits on Ch.2 whenever it's selected (via Program Change)? Can I send a Program Change for Part 2 in Performance 16 ?

3. I'd also like to be able to send expression data from the MOX to the MX for only certain Performances, but coming from every Master I have set up. So it wouldn't matter where the MOX was in Master's 1-128, whenever I select say ,Performance 1 on the MX (an organ Voice), it would receive data from the FC7 plugged into the MOX. I would filter expression on the Performances where I did not want to receive expression data using the Melas tools. Is there an easy way to do this in Master mode?

I've attached some screen shots to illustrate my current set-up....

Thanks,
Ben
Attachments (5)
Responses (13)
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Hi,

I think I've solved part of the problem:

MOX61 -- In Song/Pattern mode, Voices to be played by MX are on Ch.2, Voices to be played by MOX are on Ch.3 (Splits set within Song/Pattern Mode) Nothing set to receive on Ch1. In Master Mode, Zone 1 is set to Ch 3 to play MOX sounds.

MX49 -- Performances 1-15 are in Single Voice Mode with the Voice to be played on Part 1. Performance 16 is set to split mode with the split set at the highest note possible, meaning Part 2 is controlling the keyboard (on Midi Ch. 2) so it is essentially only transmitting midi data on Ch.2

It seems like you when you send Bank/Program Changes from the MOX to select a Performance on the MX it knocks you out of the Performance Direct Select to Performance Select. Anyway around this?

Regarding the expression pedal, I tried setting zone 2 on the MOX's Master slot to transmit only externally on Ch.1 and just checked the expression box. See below... Not working right now though.

Thanks,
Ben
Attachments (1)
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 1
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
It seems like you when you send Bank/Program Changes from the MOX to select a Performance on the MX it knocks you out of the Performance Direct Select to Performance Select. Anyway around this?
I don't believe there is because Performance Direct Select is a function of the front panel buttons and direct access to programs, not a MIDI function, at all.

Regarding the expression pedal, I tried setting zone 2 on the MOX's Master slot to transmit only externally on Ch.1 and just checked the expression box. See below... Not working right now though.
Make sure the NOTE LIMIT range of this Zone is set to trigger the same engine and make sure the receiving Part is set to receive volume messages.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 2
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Bad Mister wrote:

It seems like you when you send Bank/Program Changes from the MOX to select a Performance on the MX it knocks you out of the Performance Direct Select to Performance Select. Anyway around this?
I don't believe there is because Performance Direct Select is a function of the front panel buttons and direct access to programs, not a MIDI function, at all.


Do you have any suggestions for how I could stay in performance direct select mode, but still be able to receive a program change from the MOX and have the MX act as an external controller? Maybe by utilizing some of the other Parts in a Performance? Are there any Midi tricks on either keyboard that could help me solve this?

Regarding the expression pedal, I tried setting zone 2 on the MOX's Master slot to transmit only externally on Ch.1 and just checked the expression box. See below... Not working right now though.Make sure the NOTE LIMIT range of this Zone is set to trigger the time engine and make sure the receiving Part is set to receive volume messages.


I don't understand what the time engine refers to or how the note limit affects this. I do have the note limit set as low as possible, so that zone is not transmitting any note data.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 3
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
"time engine" ??? What? I'm the victim of technology trying to finish my sentences before I finish my thought. I think I was saying the "same" tone engine, but I see you just want adjust its volume not play it directly.

My question is: Can you play it if you do raise the NOTE LIMIT parameters? That will tell if the problem is channel related, or the receiving Part may be set to ignore volume changes.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 4
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Hi,

The answer is no, if I raise the note limit so the entire keyboard is active in the zone it just plays the MX sound but the expression pedal still doesn't work on that channel.
If I plug the FC7 directly into the MX then it works just fine, it's only when I try to send expression from the MOX that it doesn't work.

I attached some pictures to show my settings ...
Attachments (9)
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 5
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
OK, sorry for asking more questions than I'm giving answers, but is the computer a part of the setup when you are attempting all of this? Not that this would explain why notes go through and Expression cc011 does not.

If you are working with a computer connection that might explain why the pedal works when plugged direct, but not when you are routing through the computer. But if you can still communicate, then we have a mystery.

Once you connect the USB To Host port to a computer, the 5-Pin MIDI jacks role changes on the MOX - it then communicates with your system as "YamahaMOX6/MOX8-3" IN/OUT
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 6
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Yes,

I make sure and disconnect the computer first. It's definitely related to Master Mode, when I'm in Voice or Song mode the MX receives expression data.

I experimented a bit and found that it receives expression data in Voice mode, but not if the KBD trans channel is set to off in the Utility menu.

It receives expression data in Song mode but only if Part 1 is selected, and only if the Track Out Ch is on 1. This seems to relate to the Melas editors only changing the receive channel for the Part but not the transmit channel. Anyway, if I select a part that is not transmitting on Ch.1 the MX doesn't receive expression data.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 7
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
edit
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 8
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
I make sure and disconnect the computer first. It's definitely related to Master Mode, when I'm in Voice or Song mode the MX receives expression data.
OK, good. That helps.

I experimented a bit and found that it receives expression data in Voice mode, but not if the KBD trans channel is set to off in the Utility menu
That sounds correct, if you turn KBD TRANS CH = OFF this globally defeats any messages from being sent by the MOX keyboard controller for VOICE and PERFORMANCE modes.

Similarly, the BASIC RECEIVE CHANNEL setting only applies to VOICE and PERFORMANCE modes
In SONG/PATTERN modes, the track can transmit. The keyboard transmits through the currently selected track
Master mode overrides the Utility mode setting for KBD TRANS CH and follows the settings you make as long as the Zone Switch is On.

It receives expression data in Song mode but only if Part 1 is selected, and only if the Track Out Ch is on 1. This seems to relate to the Melas editors only changing the receive channel for the Part but not the transmit channel. Anyway, if I select a part that is not transmitting on Ch.1 the MX doesn't receive expression data.
That sounds correct too. In order to make the MX respond you have to be playing through an active Zone - one that is set to transmit to the EXT device on the channel you set. In Song mode you can only transmit via the currently selected track. What ever channel the track is set to transmit on is the channel the keyboard is transmitting on.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 9
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
see below....
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 10
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
I suggest you take the Editors out of the mix entirely, it will allow to see what is happening more clearly, trust me.

If you are editing the Song Mix, one transmit setting will apply, as soon as you switch to the Master Editor, another whole transmit scenario takes over. So what you applied in Song mode is overriden when you activate Master mode, even if associated with that same SONG.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 11
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Ok, so just edit from the front panel, not from the Melas editors?

I was thinking there might be some sort of bug here. After tweaking some of the Zone settings on that MOX Master Slot, expression stopped working on all zones. I used my Melas Backup to restore my data, but still ran into the same problem. I wound up saving another Master Slot with similar settings over the buggy one and expression is working ok now. Just guessing here, but I've noticed the Melas editors and MOX don't always play nice .....

I've got a dual output expression pedal that I use with another multi keyboard rig I could try if all else fails.

Will the MX send expression to the MOX if I do this? Should I turn it's kbd transmit channel off or will that totally cut it's midi to the MOX? I'm concerned because I know that if you have two expression signals coming in on one midi channel, you get some noise as a result. So the MOX could potentially receive expression from the Foot controller jack but also coming from the midi in (MX midi cable).

Thanks,
Ben
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 12
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Ok,


So for some reason in Master Mode to transmit expression data, the Volume switch has to be activated AND the FC1 switch. No bugs with the Melas editor. All set, one expression pedal should do the trick...

I did run into another strange problem,also overly complicated. Evidently in Master Mode for the AF1 button to work, you have to have one Zone running on Ch 1 and the linked Song Mode must have one Part open on Ch1. This is weird but definitely what happened.

I had set up my Master Mode to have Zone 2 sending Ext data to the MX on Ch.1 and Zone 1 transmitting Ch. 3. controlling two Voices layered in Song Mode on Parts 1 &2 transmitting on Ch 3. One Voice (Strings) has its elements set to AF1 on. I used Ch. 3 to avoid conflict with the MX.

Anyway, the AF1 button worked fine in Song Mode but as soon as I went to Master Mode, nothing. However, when I went to another Master Mode patch transmitting on Ch1 in Master and Song Mode, AF1 worked fine.

After fiddling around, I activated Part 3 in Song Mode and and set it to Ch. 1 but muted it, filtered expression, and set the Note Range as low as it would go. Then in Master Mode I activated Zone 3, set it to Ch1, only turned on the Int. switch and turned on the AF1 button only . Voila... The MX receives expression only from the MOX, doesn't sound any of the Voices in Song Mode, and in Master Mode I can control my two Voices on Ch.3, activating the String pad with the AF1 switch, essentially using it as a Mute button.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MX Series Synthesizers
  3. # 13
  • Page :
  • 1


There are no replies made for this post yet.
Be one of the first to reply to this post!
2021 © Yamaha Corporation of America and Yamaha Corporation. All rights reserved.