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  1. Michael Trigoboff
  2. Vanity Monster Sherlock Holmes The Voice
  3. MONTAGE
  4. Friday, 04 January 2019
Let's say I have an idea for a new song, or I want to do my own version of a pre-existing song. The Montage comes with a large number of Performances and Arps that could be of use to me. But how do I find the ones that I need?

At the moment, the only way I know of finding the best ones is to laboriously go through them, auditioning them until I find what I'm looking for. There is some encoding in the names of Arps, which makes it easier, but it's still a pain. And the encoding in the names of Performances is cryptic, to say the least. (The same problem exists in Cubase. The MediaBay database is helpful, but only up to a point.)

This has been a large enough problem for me that I even went to a music store a couple of days ago to see if doing this would be easier on a Genos. It turned out to be pretty much the same thing, no easier, and way more expensive.

But last night I thought of something that could really help, if Yamaha or someone else wanted to build it.

There could be an app that took as input the audio of a song, and would give you back four lists of (let's say) 10 items each, starting with most potentially useful/similar and going down from there:

* Performances
* Drum Arps
* Bass Arps
* Rhythm Arps (e.g. piano backup)

An app like this would be a competitive advantage for Yamaha. Or, alternatively, some independent software developer could potentially make money selling it.

Or does something like this already exist? If not, I'm hoping Bad Mister or some other Yamaha person will send this idea to the right place.
Responses (13)
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Or does something like this already exist?
One of the design focuses of the Genos is exactly what you describe. However, this is not the site to get deeply into this... but one function is called “Music Finder”, which like most things, has evolved over time into a highly useable function. The .mfd file format allows Music Finder setups to be created and shared. Music Finder is a function that matches Song titles with appropriate Styles, tempos, instrumentation, etc., etc., Music Finder Records can be imported from Arranger to Arranger. Folks use arrangers to quickly create popular song arrangements... so this has become a very highly evolved thing.

As to playing audio and having the device capture and create data, well, that sounds a bit ambitious... what does exist, however, is a Yamaha App called Chord Tracker, which can analyze all the songs in your iTunes library and convert them to a chord chart... which when connected to a compatible Arranger, like the Genos, it can Import the chord progressions, and select the most appropriate Style, set the correct tempo... it can even make recommendations ... after “listening” to the song!

Yeah, it’s twice as much (you can’t see it all in one visit... did you have a Manual, or anyone around qualified to show it to you?)
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 1
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
I had the manual. But just by having the manual, I think I was the one in the store who knew the most about it.

I will look into that Music Finder technology. Sounds interesting. Thanks!
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 2
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
I just read up on the Music Finder. The databases for it are available for free online!

If I had a list of PSR/Tyros Styles and the corresponding Motif XF/Montage Performances, I could easily make a translation database. Does anyone know if such a list exists?
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 3
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Hi Michael,

I use both Montage and Genos and wished I had a hybrid. Both have there advantages and it would be great to have a real top-of-the-line machine which has it all.

When searching for a template to play along, the Genos-styles are great. They cover almost every genre. So you should be able to find a suitable backing-style. Genos has something called PLAYLIST. It can be found at https://nl.yamaha.com/nl/products/musical_instruments/keyboards/arranger_workstations/genos/downloads.html It is explained in this video by Bonners
Attachments (1)
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 4
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
I use both Montage and Genos and wished I had a hybrid. Both have there advantages and it would be great to have a real top-of-the-line machine which has it all.
Awesome!
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 5
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
For a lot less money you could pick up a Tyros 3 - that has 'Music Finder' and a ton of good backing tracks too - mine hooked into the Montage frightens me to death! My only gripe with it is that the Montage recorder, for some reason I find unaccountable, will not record the 'Style' element of the Tyros input to the Montage A/D.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 6
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Sorry to add an off topic reply; however I don't know what else to do or who to contact. My account allows me to log in and post on existing topics, but I am having two issues that I am hoping someone (moderator) on here can help me with:
- I can't post new topics! It just gives me the following error no matter what the topic is or what category I post in: "The system has flagged your message as spam. Please try again."
- Yamaha Ideascale Community License Expired. I tried posting this as a topic since I can't find a contact on here to address the issue; however this forum will not allow me to post the new topic and gave the error above:
Subject: Yamaha Ideascale Issue
Message: I was just logged into https://yamahasynth.ideascale.com/ and could not submit new ideas, nor vote on existing ones. I chatted with one of the site admins and they said that the community license expired. Does anyone here know who to contact to renew the license, or have Yamaha decided not to continue with using Ideascale?
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 7
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
... if Ben says Yamaha has to pay a fee to keep Ideascale going -- and this hasn't been done -- then that's only something Yamaha can do. I suppose unless you crowd fund some amount and donate it. But even so, ideascale has to be aligned with Yamaha objectives to keep it going (even if it were no-cost to implement). Recently the same team that runs ideascale met virtually and in person with consumers to gather ideas on keyboard futures. It may be that they have lots of data to sort through and Ideascale is overload.

Whatever happened to ideascale seems recent since I see activity (upvotes) as soon as 15 hours ago.

Your best contact is likely who you've spoken to already:

Email: This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
Phone Number: (714) 522-9049

Even though your post is off-topic for most of this forum - it is certainly off-topic for this thread. It would have been advisable to open up a new thread in one of the areas designated for off-topic discussion.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 8
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Even though your post is off-topic for most of this forum - it is certainly off-topic for this thread. It would have been advisable to open up a new thread in one of the areas designated for off-topic discussion.

I can't open a new thread in any off-topic or other designated area. I keep getting the same error. My yamahasynth.com account is blocked from opening any new topics for discussion, thus i am hoping someone can fix this for me...!?
I just tried in the 'off topic' area, and received the same error: "The system has flagged your message as spam. Please try again."
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 9
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
The spam filter is sometimes overly aggressive - so I certainly understand. Hopefully the web admins monitor here so they can try to address or another Yamaha admin can move these few messages to the area which is more commonly fielded by the web team. Although part of your message is not related to the board - the part about not being able to use the facilities to post to off-topic areas is certainly valuable and explains why you've resorted to posting here. Sorry you're having trouble. I've run into the same thing in the past.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 10
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Hi --

I currently play both MODX and Genos, finding the two to be complementary. Genos is mainly for practice and writing while the lightweight MODX is great for gigs.

In case anyone is interested, I converted a smattering of funky/jazzy Motif XS/MOX performances to PSR/Tyros. They work fine on Genos, too:

http://sandsoftwaresound.net/motif-styles-for-your-arranger/

For the me, the optimal synth to arranger ratio is N to 1, where N is unbounded. :D

-- pj
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 11
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Michael's project idea reminds me of "name that tune" on Motifator, i.e., Motif performances that sound like well-known songs. I've attached a list that I scraped from old posts. Maybe it will help populate the initial database of tunes.

All the best -- pj
Attachments (1)
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 12
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Thanks, Paul!
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE
  3. # 13
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